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 A new blood (or what's left of it)

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CaveM
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PostSubject: A new blood (or what's left of it)   Sat Mar 10, 2012 5:28 am

Hi, i want to apply to your guild, here's my application.

Also, english is not my native language, i'm definately not perfect at it, but i think i can communicate on a level decent enough.

OOC information

Character name:

Now i have a problem. I have created this character before i tried to apply to your guild. Now i read guild terms, and it reads you are not in favor of substantive-like character names. I named my character Deathcave. I always name my characters with a "cave" in it, as it has something to do with my old nick (long story). I have alts like Cavecrawler, Cavesurveyor, Cave'jin. It doesn't mean anything, and i just interpret it as a certain sound. Looking up WOWwiki there are example of Forsaken surnames that are similar in sound, Blacksling, Blastlich. So i personally think my surname is acceptable (i would think of it as invented after being risen into un-life, in order to leave the past behind). The name is much less problem as it is basically human in origin.

That was long sorry Smile

So: Roland Deathcave.

Class:

Priest

Why do you want to join the Cult?:

I love undead, their unique placement between evil and good adds a bit more realistic, maybe less epic, more psychological theme to the WOW universe. They are very nuanced and less cliché.

Also, a thing maybe not highlighted here, but definately present in WOW's undead, is the dark humor, which i love. From jaw-stitching problems to finding a murloc companion to sexual relations of undead - the opportunities present themselves.

My main belongs to Benevolent guild, but i wanted also to taste the RP-strictly guild. That's why i opt to put my alt in another, RP-oriented, guild.

How did you come to learn about the Cult:

by browsing the guilds on the server Smile

Anything else you'd like us to know?

I'm new to WOW. 1 month now. My highest lvl char is 44, not on this server, but will probably migrate soon. THis means no highlvl gear, no raid experience, no heirlooms and all that.

WOW is also my first MMO.

No online-RP experience. Have some experience in pencil'n'paper RPG though (Deadlands mostly).


IC application:

(i'll try to narrate as much as my english allows me to)

In life Roland was a priest. He at least supposed to be. The rich inheritance, the noble family (Oakspines) backing, made him a spoiled child. His family indeed treated the whole priesthood as a family business. The power of the light catered to those of strong will and pure heart, so the Oakspines weren't particularily good at what other priests were famous for, namely the arcane. They were more focused on ensuring the peasants and vassals worked at 100% efficiency and that the wheat export is kept at it's highest. THat was Roland's inheritance: business, preaching, and women, wine and feasts in between.

Then came the war. As the family business consisted mostly of wheat trading, they were one of the priority targets of the Lich King's followers' schemes. The business turned to ruin in matter of the days. All the earthly pleasures Roland has endured, have suddenly ended. Worse still, large part of the family and folk turned to undead. Even though the battle throughout the Oakspines estates was won with an extreme effort of paid mercenaries, the frightened people of Lordaeron were no longer willing to consume food not produced within their own farms. Worse still, some of them gathered to set the noble's estates on fire as the source of corruption. The remnants of the once proud, though decadent, noble family fled their own estates to become beggars.

Even now, as an undead of clear mind, Roland hardly remembers what happened after. It was all nightmare, a shock of a spoiled noble that lost everything. The Light has finally all but abandonded him. The kingdom of Lordaeron itself crumbled. Nothing to hold on to. He was no more than an animal. Death came as a blessing.

If he was so crushed, then how was it, that he was one of the strongest in the batch of new Forsaken recruits risen by Val'kyr in the name of the Dark Lady? He still ponders... Maybe it was the anger inside him, that he was able to lose everything so easily, or more so: that he wasted his life on something so fleeting. He was so full of self-hatred, he thought of himself as a monster - still as a living being! So the sight of the rotting flesh, visible bones, parts of body stitched from different corpses - didn't make an impression on him at all. In fact he instantly felt there was some perverse beauty in it. But what was the best in all this was the feeling of immense power, of transcending death in to the undeath, of being able to govern useless flesh. That, plus the hatred towards everything that life has to give. Actually, all life can give is pain. So as he channels the power of Light he learned to as a priest, he just grins (as much as his rotten muscles allow him to) at the immense pain it causes to undead being, a reminder of how worthless life was.

He soon learned the name of that which brought him back to un-life, of this sentient power that was there within him, though he didn't see it, but which allowed him to survive so long in a war-torn land, after he lost everything.

Will.

Light... how could it be then that he was so corrupted even adhering to this failing religion? Becouse it's just a piece of the truth. People forgot, or just don't want to remember - the Shadow.
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PostSubject: Re: A new blood (or what's left of it)   Sat Mar 10, 2012 5:41 am

And btw, noob question: what is lolrp? Could find the others (power emoting etc.) but not this one. Thanks for help.
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PostSubject: Re: A new blood (or what's left of it)   Sat Mar 10, 2012 9:58 am

LolRP consists of extreme poor levels of role-play or breaking those unsaid golden rules

God emoting/God-play
The reference of 'god' to any style of role-play means that you undertake decisions on behalf of other people. Be it in an emote or in a storyline, it is rude and looked down.

Metagaming
Metagaming in it's most direct description is the use of out-of-character information for in-character means.
An example would go as follows.

Morthimus tells Aremus a secret in whisper, strictly out of character, as one friend to another.
Aremus then role-plays this secret out.

Wrong and lookd down.

Power-emoting/power-play
Power emoting in it's purest form is role-playing a character that is exceptionally strong, intelligent or well, powerful. You defeat your opponents and do not take hits in return, you are also capable of sustaining large amounts of damage and running away even if you are cursed or your legs are damaged/stabbed/cut.

Power-play is different, this includes power-emoting too but power-play also defines a character who holds automatic power over another character. For example, role-playing as something dumb and stupid as a heavy lore related character. For example -

Trollbane, Menethil, Windrunner, so on and so forth. This classifies as LolRP / power-play.

Power-play is also related to giving yourself fancy titles such as High Marshal, General, Overlord, (especially those related to NPC factions and not only limited to your guild). Many people with high titles rule over their own guild (acceptable) few have been seen to claim titles and attempt to exert power over other characters in-character (LolRP) and vigorously defended such actions OOC on the grounds that "they earned it". Nobody can earn being above other people (unless it is a guild promotion). Universally nobody has the right to promote another person to be above every other person automatically, this is LolRP and power-play.

This is my personal opinion but I believe there is not much else to add.
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PostSubject: Re: A new blood (or what's left of it)   Sat Mar 10, 2012 7:52 pm

Thank you for all the info Smile
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Dunderholm of Ambermill
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PostSubject: Re: A new blood (or what's left of it)   Mon Mar 12, 2012 12:43 pm

I do have a question before I set my stamp.

Quote :
So as he channels the power of Light he learned to as a priest, he just grins (as much as his rotten muscles allow him to) at the immense pain it causes to undead being, a reminder of how worthless life was.

It's suggested here that you channel the powers of the light whilst being undead, now this isn't impossible but very very very difficult and painfull.
We currently have two priests within the Cult that are able to wield the power of the Light ICly.

It takes a lot of training and willpower to be able to use the light ICly as an undead, as it has abbadoned us.
So if you RP a freshly risen, it's impossible but if you are ICly a priest who has had already extensive training I would deem it possible but still very diffucult to perform on a dailly basis.

One final thing
Quote :
From jaw-stitching problems to finding a murloc companion to sexual relations of undead
Hu? What? Forsaken don't feel the need for Love or anything like this. Unless echo's of life, but those are rare in an Old Forsaken.

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PostSubject: Re: A new blood (or what's left of it)   Mon Mar 12, 2012 4:58 pm

Dunderholm of Ambermill wrote:

We currently have two priests within the Cult that are able to wield the power of the Light ICly.

Mad Mad Mad Mad
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PostSubject: Re: A new blood (or what's left of it)   Mon Mar 12, 2012 6:38 pm

Light: That's why I included info about the pain. Didn't know that this is rare - it probably stems from my confusion as to the lore of schools of magic. Read a bit on wowwiki now, though this seems really chaotic, probably as the most complicated aspect of lore. I thought that the healing spells must come from the Light (especially as you can heal other races with them), but it seems WOWwiki states that the Forgotten Shadow magic powers are "similar" to the Holy Light magic. It does seem to contradict the fact that DPS priest spec is called "shadow priest", as it would seem that the Forgotten Shadow has nothing to do with this "Shadow". From what i read in WOWwiki now, both Shadow and Light are Divine schools of magic that draw it's powers from faith in something external, and does not differ when it comes to the function of spells but rather the nature of them.

The question remains, do the living beings feel the pain when healed by shadow magic? Can it possibly kill them when not mastered?

We can say that my character cannot really use the powers of the Light, as he doesn't have the will to maintain the concentration required, due to the pain. But he does remember the rituals of the Light from his previous life, so he sometimes sends the current of Light through his body as a masochistic reminder of how pathetic life was.

About the other thing, there was this guy who gave you a quest to find him a murloc companion, which clearly indicates the ability to feel loneliness, need for companion, and ultimately love (in it's Platonic form). Love is also a family bond, and there were also quests of forsaken having feelings towards their old families (even if it was betrayal, hatred - you cannot feel betrayed if you didn't feel the need for being loved). As to sexuality, i was wondering about the fact, that a Forsaken can have a memory of his previous life, that means also of a sexual aspect of his previous life. It is clear that he doesn't feel any sexual drive right now, as most of his body has atrophied, and the source of un-life is clearly not biological. Nevertheless i wonder how awkward would it be to see people you have felt attraction to as an undead. It would probably make you quite cynical towards the earthly emotions, and that cynism i made a central point of my character. More even, it would be possible to see beauty in the undead form (hating ones physical presentation does seem to contradict the faith in the Cult) and this would lead to awkward cultural differences between the undead and other races (or the OOC players, couse that's what humor is about).
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PostSubject: Re: A new blood (or what's left of it)   Mon Mar 12, 2012 8:03 pm

I'm not easily impressed, but I must say, you've given it quite a bit of thought.
Also, because CaveM brought it up, I feel obliged to continue on it, Shadow magic in the form that we use it, is divine magic.
The usage of it stems from worship of the Forgotten Shadow(ever singular), so it's a visible contradiction that a follower of this religion, as a creature of shadow, can utilise the polar opposite magic, being Light, as it requires devotion to this religion also.
Yes, before you play that card, Forsaken CAN use Light, but it requires an unyielding belief in their former faith of the Holy Light. Also an option is the belief of equality, but it seems rather hard to follow this belief when your battlecry of choice is Death to the Living, so all creatures NOT born of the Shadow. So, for a follower of the Forgotten Shadow, Light magic is the uttermost heresy.
But warlocks use shadow magic, you might think. This is correct, but they use fel foremost.
Look at Light and Shadow as Yin and Yang--the hollow concept of Taoism might not be the most comprehensible of analogies, but since it's so often used in pop culture, it'll have to do--those two keep the universe in balance, one is love, selflessness and all other good, while the other is greed, power and selfishness. To quote a certain Naaru "Without the void, Light cannot exist".
But, fel stands outside of this. It seeks to destroy this order and balance, but being a fel-user, the principles of Shadow would be fairly easy to relate to, and this magic would serve as a tool to destroy the order.
Yes, this is not the absolute truth, but having roleplayed this for over three years, and often discussed with others, it seems that most of them agree on this view, as it's the only one that makes relative sense and covers the package.

P.S: Forsaken can still cling to their old lives in a state of transition, and try to imitate feelings as love and selflessness, until they stumble upon the inevitable truth that they're just evil. I'm actually quite relieved someone brings it up again, roleplaying letting go of your former life, or retaining a fixation of said former life, is just all the more interesting.
It could be anything, sparing the life of a prisoner, being attracted to a living human, taking great care of some pet, displaying friendship towards one of your kith, anything that serves as a memento from a former ghost of a life few Forsaken are done clinging to. Even a priest following his former beliefs, and using Light, can be seen as another step in the transitional phase, until even he realizes he really is forsaken.
P.S.S: I just keep writing, but I wish to provide an answer for the question asked. Yes, living can be hurt by beneficial shadow spells, but it requires their souls in essence to be of the light. I'm thinking paladins, priests and other goody two-shoes. I'd figure normal, 'untainted' souls would be healed, although the effect would be greatly diminished compared to a Forsaken, whose soul is a molested, tortured, ripped apart thing of the Shadow.
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PostSubject: Re: A new blood (or what's left of it)   Mon Mar 12, 2012 8:58 pm

On an entirely different note, and as to not look silly with the sheer amount of P.S's, the naming rules were aimed at first names mostly, surnames with an adjective are fairly common in Forsaken society. Should edit that, my apologies.
And, it is more a guideline than clear-cut rules, as most who would pick Deathbringer as their character's name would be roleplayers of questionable quality.
Since you obviously don't belong to this group, an exception would gladly be made, if you would want cave- something as your first name.
(As long as you don't start calling yourself Naruto).
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PostSubject: Re: A new blood (or what's left of it)   Mon Mar 12, 2012 9:32 pm

Is being "evil" really an inevitable truth? Being self-centered doesn't equal being evil to me... Especially that many undead are not undead by choice. I must say I dislike such clear-cut distinctions. For example one can say that Night Elves are a bit evil, couse they belief in nature's balance may couse them to kill someone they love of out faith if that this someone disrupts the balance... it's kind of totalitarian, against individuality, you're only worth anything if you contribute to the balance... so for a certain Forsaken, a night elf druid may seem evil.

I'd rather play a character who believes that Shadow is good and that sometimes Light can be evil, as it opposes individuality. I don't claim it is a lore truth, but i'd leave the truth as a controversial and unresolved matter even OOC. It's more fun that way i think.

Also the original lore mentions that the relligion of Forgotten SHadow itself has many conflicting interpretations and there are lots of internal fights over the matters of faith.

Quote :
battlecry of choice is Death to the Living,

I didn't know that... is it one of religion's goals?
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PostSubject: Re: A new blood (or what's left of it)   Mon Mar 12, 2012 9:44 pm

I think I can add something about the Light training "in-life" works in "unlife"... well.. yes/no.
Every discipline or science has axioms, demonstration, theories. If I pick (for example) an usual ritual based with light, it will be composed by several ritual-steps, and each one of this steps can collapse in several spells, and each one of this spells comes from the light; every one of this spells has a different way of manipulation of the power of the light.. some of them comes from prayers, others form modulation of the flow of light.. (I am just guessing, there is no lore about a priest can compose a spell from the raw power of light).

What I am trying to say is that the ritual in example is assuming a lot of knowledge of his steps, and a middle-aged priest who passed his life in study should know A LOT of ways to manipulate the power required of each step/spell/...

A forsaken that prays the light will not be answered like an human do, the manipulation of the power of the light needed to generate a spell will change because the very flow of light that the forsaken priest can reach is extremely different from when he was human, the light itself will be felt different and will work in opposite/twisted ways.
The human priest passed his life studying how to manage the light assuming an human perspective of the light, and "switching" forsaken will change EVERY spell he knows in a way that he never had the chance to learn... It is like changing the real numbers set with something different from a mathematician: his entire world will be destroyed, all of his knowledge will be confused, twisted...

I hope i was able to give the idea :V
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PostSubject: Re: A new blood (or what's left of it)   Mon Mar 12, 2012 9:59 pm

It's THE goal which you fixate upon!
And you do raise a valid point, being self-centered is not evil on it's own, it is merely not altruistic or 'good' . But being self-centered, at the cost of others, is evil. This is a recurring theme in our first are foremost virtue, Power.
If you're familiar with the Star Wars franchise, you'd do well to compare the followers of the Forgotten Shadow to the Sith, their code can be interpreted as more or less in line with our own.
"Power is for those strong enough to grasp it, your will is a way to power."

Ultimately however, Forsaken do evil. They blight entire nations, and kill without conscience or a second thought, all out of wicked devotion for the Banshee Queen. Yes, they do not choose to be made undead, but in becoming so, their moral compass is stepped upon and grind into pieces, only vestiges remaining from a Forsaken's previous life, and some cling to these remains more than others.
Some Forsaken have come to grips with this, and revel in it, others have the inverted belief that the Light has forsaken them, and the Shadow saved their souls. Thus, the Shadow is good, and Light is evil. Others again simply don't think it trough that far, and cult propaganda plus their devotion to the almighty figure of Sylvanas leads them to hate all things non-Forsaken. What those things are, is irrelevant, it's heresy, and therefore it needs to be destroyed.
It offers a very new perspective on the thought patterns of a Forsaken, a depth very few Forsaken roleplayers go into.
And this Cult, is a unified front of religion, different interpretations remain, but the Prophet's and the Shadowpope's words are law, and walking the fine line between encouraged debate on faith, and heresy, is yet another aspect you can exploit.

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PostSubject: Re: A new blood (or what's left of it)   Mon Mar 12, 2012 10:00 pm

And i like the idea Smile
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PostSubject: Re: A new blood (or what's left of it)   Mon Mar 12, 2012 10:27 pm

They do? Didn't know that. ALl i know is this Putress guy but from what the lore tells me the Forsaken's opinion of his actions seems to be negative overall.

I read the virtues again and i still don't see this as a necessary consequence of the "Power" virtue. There's a lot of space for reinterpretation of the original words. So if i'm thinking correctly, you play a guild that is a unified interpretation of the virtues along the lines of Sith doctrine in SW universe. That's cool, but i don't know if my idea for a char fits this as i thought it would.

-----

On a different note i have a feeling, and it's entirely my own individual interpretation i know, that all races are mistaken in their ways... It's like in Warcraft 3 intro, we fought like fools until the sky rained fire... Like with the frostmane trolls thing, the troggs push the trolls from their homes, and the only answer both sides (dwarves and trolls) have to that is: "kill". I blame both the dwarves and trolls here personally, they both encourage bloodshed.

Quote :
and kill without conscience or a second thought,

judging from how the quests in WOW are constructed, all races have this affinity to kill without conscience in the name of sth they believe in unfortunately. This is my dark interpretation of wow. Twisted Evil of course it's becouse gameplay is centred around fighting but still...

-------

you know guys, i thought things through and i think i should focus on one guild for now. But i would love to be able to participate in some forum lore related discussions, so if you would like to grant me the forum access i would be grateful. But if not, then farewell and thank you for reading all this.
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Drathun

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PostSubject: Re: A new blood (or what's left of it)   Tue Mar 13, 2012 12:04 am

You'd be very welcome to stay and join in on any discussions we have, also feel free to attend any sermon ICly, I'm sure any other active officer would be glad to provide you with the details.
On an unrelated note, this Benevolent guild, on what realm is it?
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PostSubject: Re: A new blood (or what's left of it)   Tue Mar 13, 2012 12:13 am

Here, on Defias Smile
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PostSubject: Re: A new blood (or what's left of it)   Tue Mar 13, 2012 12:21 am

My apologies, I have been away from the DB RP scene for a while now, the guild's name must have escaped my memory.
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PostSubject: Re: A new blood (or what's left of it)   Tue Mar 13, 2012 2:27 am

Drathun wrote:

Ultimately however, Forsaken do evil. They blight entire nations, and kill without conscience or a second thought.

Well... If I kill someone i can assert that:
  • I am following the Virtue of Respect, so that my murder is calculated and well-planned and that will not create troubles to me or my Brothers and Sisters (so yes, I have second thoughts).
  • I don't feel evil at all.. I am giving him Death.. I am moved by goodness and compassion: I am blessing someone with the virtue of Death.. that is not evil.
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PostSubject: Re: A new blood (or what's left of it)   Tue Mar 13, 2012 3:39 am

Quote :
You'd be very welcome to stay and join in on any discussions we have

If so then could you please pass a word to the admin to activiate my forum account?

And BTW Benevolent are not RP guild that much, they're just social, but a really good social.
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PostSubject: Re: A new blood (or what's left of it)   Wed Mar 14, 2012 12:58 am

Uaget wrote:
Drathun wrote:

Ultimately however, Forsaken do evil. They blight entire nations, and kill without conscience or a second thought.

Well... If I kill someone i can assert that:
  • I am following the Virtue of Respect, so that my murder is calculated and well-planned and that will not create troubles to me or my Brothers and Sisters (so yes, I have second thoughts).
  • I don't feel evil at all.. I am giving him Death.. I am moved by goodness and compassion: I am blessing someone with the virtue of Death.. that is not evil.

I was talking strictly out of character concerning morality, but what your character seems to be convinced of is a beautiful consequence of successful cult propaganda, having the inverted view I mentioned earlier.
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PostSubject: Re: A new blood (or what's left of it)   Wed Mar 14, 2012 5:35 am

That's your personal OOC opinion. I don't think we can at all evaluate forsaken morals with categories of our world. We live in a world where death is an absolute end to existence. In world of warcraft, with spirits, different planes of existence, magical healing and ressurection, and undead - death is something different. I think it's more like bioengineering, where the body is reshaped into a new form, although it's still a vague comparison. Of course there is the evil of pain itself but it cannot compare to what death is to us. Also we don't live in a world so consumed by war and mutual hatred as Azeroth.

In short i think the world of warcraft is so different from ours, that we cannot use there the moral criteria of our world. I can as much say that you were subconsciously influenced by Alliance propaganda in your assesment of Forsaken actions.

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PostSubject: Re: A new blood (or what's left of it)   Wed Mar 14, 2012 11:04 am

CaveM wrote:
That's your personal OOC opinion. I don't think we can at all evaluate forsaken morals with categories of our world. We live in a world where death is an absolute end to existence. In world of warcraft, with spirits, different planes of existence, magical healing and ressurection, and undead - death is something different. I think it's more like bioengineering, where the body is reshaped into a new form, although it's still a vague comparison. Of course there is the evil of pain itself but it cannot compare to what death is to us. Also we don't live in a world so consumed by war and mutual hatred as Azeroth.

In short i think the world of warcraft is so different from ours, that we cannot use there the moral criteria of our world. I can as much say that you were subconsciously influenced by Alliance propaganda in your assesment of Forsaken actions.

From the WoWWiki on the forsaken, ... just a small part from it.

Quote :
Undead humans and elves freed from the Lich King's control, the Forsaken are a strange and dark force. Hailing from the twisted, skittering darkness of Undercity, the Forsaken are nominally allied with the Horde but serve only themselves. Their objectives are twofold: eliminate the Scourge, and establish a place for themselves on Azeroth. Four years ago, the high elven Ranger General Sylvanas Windrunner fell in combat against the Scourge. Prince Arthas raised her as a banshee and compelled her to follow his command. When the Lich King's power waned in the incidents surrounding the Frozen Throne, Sylvanas harnessed her fury and tore herself free from his skeletal grasp. She freed many other undead as well, and recruited powerful allies from the Burning Legion and the surrounding ogre clans. Sylvanas dubbed her new force the Forsaken, and the undead established their capital in the labyrinthine crypts beneath Lordaeron's capital city. Their sprawling, subterranean realm is called Undercity. The Forsaken made allies of the Horde out of necessity and convenience. They have no love for orcs, tauren or any other living creature, but they need time to strike against the Scourge and allies to help them do it. The Forsaken claim that they joined the Horde to prove their desire to leave their evil ways behind, but no one really believes this. The Horde accepts the Forsaken's help, as they do indeed have a common enemy: the Scourge.

http://www.wowwiki.com/Forsaken


Also, the Hatreds in WoW do not compare with Hatreds in the real world you say?
Now we don't have orcs ands elves in the real world. The hatreds are very real.
If I would get 10 cents for every hatecrime, racial discrimination, murder, war, torture etc etc performed in this realworld I would be a freaking Biljonair.

Also take note that the so called spirits and planes of existence and ressurection are things that are very very very rare ICly.
Characters (who are decent roleplayers imo) do not go on fieldtrips to distant planes or get ressurected from the dead.
It just doesn't happen, even in Lore it is very rare.

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PostSubject: Re: A new blood (or what's left of it)   Wed Mar 14, 2012 1:28 pm

CaveM wrote:
I don't think we can at all evaluate forsaken morals with categories of our world

Totally agree, and even in our ooc world evil is something that can't be defined.

Dictionary wrote:

Evil: morally wrong or bad; immoral;

Dictionary wrote:

* Moral: of, pertaining to, or concerned with the principles or rules of right conduct or the distinction between right and wrong; ethical:
* morals, principles or habits with respect to right or wrong conduct.

Now tell me. If I ask ICly Dunderholm if it is right or wrong killing, what would he answer?...
Even in the real world there are different opinion about what is right, and what is wrong. For example for me is evil the capital punishment, while it is not for a lot of others.
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PostSubject: Re: A new blood (or what's left of it)   Wed Mar 14, 2012 5:01 pm

Of course the violence don't compare. From what it seems there are at least some peaceful enclaves in the real world, but in WOW there are almost none, war is practically everywhere and every day seems to be a fight for survival. I would say even that the omnipresence of war is not comparable within our world between medieval times and present - at least i don't imagine taking up sword and going on a crusade and don't imagine any of my friends do that... With all the violence going on in the world, i believe we live in RELATIVELY peaceful times. When one Polish soldier dies in Afghanistan it is a media tragedy, can't imagine orcs making such a noise around death of a single grunt in fight between some local Naga threat.

And the WOWwiki says nobody trusts them, but does not reveal their supposed real motives, leaving them a mystery. I also can't believe, no matter how mindlessly loyal to Sylvanas they would be, that there are no differences within the Forsaken, both Putress and Royal Apothecary Sociaty follow their own agenda a bit, we cannot thus say that all Forsaken follow one goal, it's just isn't believable to me. I remember when one of Apothecaries stutters "we... erm... Sylvanas is grateful".

Spirits are also not a rare encounter in the world of WOW, of course statistically maybe not as much common, but this just proves how much death is there, hehe. And undeath is quite common especially with the mass raising of new forsaken by the Val'kyr these days... But even the possiblity itself - is such a change compared to our world.

Of course that's my vision of WOW nobody has to agree... In your world all Forsaken can be evil beings answering the call of a single Banshee. In your world the gift of undeath can put one inadvertedly on the path of evil. No problem to me. It's the world of fiction, truth is even more blurred there.
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Rasonal
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PostSubject: Re: A new blood (or what's left of it)   Wed Mar 14, 2012 6:57 pm

I will lock the thread. Although the discussion may be interesting, it is not the place to hold it. The application has been approved, I believe, so no need for it to be open. Take the discussion in game, or into the forums themselves.
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